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SIX MEDrORD (OREGON) MAIL TRIBUNE Monday. October 7, 1957 Irs. Roosevelt, Khrushchev Discuss Who First Sold Arms to Other Nations By ELEANOR ROOSEVELT Cincinnati, Ohio I question ed Nikita S. Khrushchev, chief of the Communist party in the Soviet Union, in my interview with him at Yalta on the Soviet position in the Near East and he accused the United States of first selling arms to countries in that area. Here is a continuation of the interview from my two previous columns: Roosevelt: Cannot we come to a reconsideration of our whole attitude in the Middle East? . Khrushchev: Mrs. Roosevelt, you don't know about the pro posals that were made by the Soviet Union, that no country should sell arms to any country in the Near East. The U. S. re fused. (Dr. David Gurewitsch, break ing in: We only refused after arms 'had already been sent to Egypt and Syria by the Soviet Union, so the balance had al ready been destroyed.) Khrushchev: Are you the head of military supply, Dr. Gurewitsch? I don't think you know the exact situation. Roosevelt: I don't think any of us knows the exact situation, but it might, however, be brought up in the disarmament conference or in the United Nations. Khrushchev: I ask you: Who first started selling arms to the countries we or you? How about Pakistan? Roosevelt: I think you did. Pakistan is not the Near East. It is further away. (Dr. Gurewitsch, breaking in: The question was: Who first sold arms?). Roosevelt: I would say that we believed the Soviet Union first began to send arms to oth er countries. I think the only thing to do about the situation today is to bring it up in the U.N. and try to come to some agree ments. Khrushchev: You haven't ans wered my question. You do not like Communists, and I . have nothing against this because I may not love the people who stand on other platforms. But people might be honest. That is why my question: Who were the first to sell arms to other coun tries and not only sell but sup ply free of charge? Who was the first? I respect you greatly and I ap preciate the activities of your great husband, Franklin Roose velt, but the "whole world knows that the U.S.A. started first the supply of arms, so I hoped to have an honest talk, otherwise we cannot be sure of the inter pretation of this talk. Roosevelt: Are we going back to the Marshall Plan? Khrushchev: It is no matter whether it is the Marshall Plan or any other plan. I know the U.S.A. supplied all our enemies with arms. Roosevelt: The emphasis of the Marshall Plan was on eco nomic development within the countries. Khrushchev: Arms are also economic aid? Roosevelt: I agree that many countries in the West received arms, and I see how the Soviet Union could feel that those were provided against them, but we in the U.S. would . say that we had reached a point where we had begun to feel that the So viet Union had military inten tions against the West. Khrushchev: What were the arms supplied for? We never had them for tea parties. Roosevelt: I think our first suspicion rose at the time of the Berlin airlift when the Soviets seemed to be trying to push us out. I will grant that we may have made mistakes, but I also think that you made mistakes. Having been here, I realize that your people do not want war. Khrushchev: If you say the people do not want war, who wants war their representa tives? Roosevelt: The government, perhaps. For they do things on both sides which they believe are for the defense of the peo ple. This happens in our coun try and it probably happens in yours. Khrushchev: It takes place in your country. Roosevelt: If so, it also takes place in yours. Khrushchev: Definitely not in my country. Roosevelt: Oh, it does. Govern ments are much the same. .Khrushchev: There are signs. There is logic; there is experi ence, so we may check up. Whose troops approach the borderline? Do the Soviet troops approach the U.S. border? It is the Amer ican troops who approach the border of the Soviet Union. Yes, they are there. Roosevelt: We are not trying to enter-the Soviet Union. Khrushchev: They do try. Roosevelt: We are not trying. But it' can be only a defensive attitude if we are to have any kind of amicable coexistence. We cannot go on with arming both sides. Could we work for a greater interchange of people on every level in order to get greater understanding? Khrushchev: I am surprised, Mrs. Roosevelt. Maybe you are not informed quite well what the situation is. We never refuse. We always allow people to come Television Quiz Influence Seen New York (IP) At least one important American educator is skeptical about the influence for good that the currently popular quiz whizzes on television shows are exercising. "Perhaps we are laying too much stress on the quizz show mentality in selecting young peo ple for scholarships," said Dr. Carroll V. Newsom, president of New York University and a di rector of a scholarship fund (Fruit of the Loom Foundation). "I think it would be very in teresting to award a group of scholarships on the basis of ac complishment other than the standard competitive examina tions. It would be rewarding, too, to compare the winners of these scholarships with those who have won by competitive examination to see which group fares better in college and after." Merwin J. Joseph, chairman of the fund and a vice president of the company . financing the scholarships, said: ' "The fact is that many quiz heroes are mental freaks, with literally 'photographic minds.' Capable of accumulating miscel laneous facts the way an attic collects junk, they are not capa ble of making any original con tribution to society. "To a great extent, competi tive scholarship examinations, like the quiz shows, favor this type of mentality. They put a premium on memory, or compet itiveness, and on sheer luck. They undervalue ambition, per sonality, drive and, above all, creativeness. Yet these are the qualities that build progress." v, a jf- ie ' y x- j EXPRESSING HATRED for Negroes, one of Little Rock's Central High School students who walked out of classes in protest against admittance of nine Negroes drives knife into back of Negro effigy. Crudely made dummy was hung in tree across street from school. (International Soundphoto) o EXTRA SPECIAL PRICE LOCKER BEEF ft& ih HIND QUARTERS ID Cut and Wrapped NORTHERN STAMPS JIM'S MEATS here, but you never give a visa to our citizens. Roosevelt: We don't always al low Communists to come to the U.S. Neither do you always al low people to leave your coun try, even if we manage to get visas for them. Khrushchev: Tell us anyone we haven't allowed to come here. Roosevelt: I am not saying you don't allow people to come to the U.S.S.R., but you take a very long time to grant their visas. On your side, you did not want to accept our fingerprint ing. Having been here, I under stand your feeling and so I am glad that provision can now be waived. The thing that disturbs us is the difficulty the people have who want to leave the So viet Union, even for visits. Khrushchev: We allow every body to come here, no matter how he blames the Soviet Un ion. Still, we allow him to come here and see what is going on here. We are not afraid. Roosevelt: I would sum up the feeling of the people in the U.S. by saying that it was what the Soviets did in Eerlin that started our suspicions. North Ko rea, North Viet Nam, Egypt, and Syria added to them. Misunder standings have grown and there is fear on both sides. We will have to do things to create con fidence. One thing that can be done is a broader exchange of people. Khrushchev: I fully- agree, Mrs. Roosevelt. Roosevelt: Have you any sug gestions to make, or any ques tions to ask me? Khrushchev: We have stated many times our purposes. But the U.S.A. is used to speaking, to dictating, so they only speak about conditions which they will accept. I want to explain what are the words and what are the deeds. Where are the troops and whose troops are they? Roosevelt: If we could stop thinking for a moment about atomic weapons, we would still have in the U.S.S.R. a very great standing army which could quickly move across Europe, and this makes Europeans fearful if they have no defense. Khrushchev: There was a time when in Germany, England and France there was no American army and our army was much bigger, but we did nothing. We are not so stupid to make tricks. We have never made any at tempts against these countries. Roosevelt: When you read a paper in the Soviet Union, you find very little news about the outside world. Every mention of the U.S. is about something bad which has happened there. For instance, the only news I have seen is on what occurred in Lit tle Rock, Ark., on integration of schools, but this problem affects about seven out of 48 states. Khrushchev: But the seven states are the U.S. of America. Roosevelt: Only a small part. Khrushchev: We also have small republics. They make up the whole state of the U.S.S.R and they, are equal in rights. Roosevelt: We do not have cen tral control, so our states have certain rights. Khrushchev: In our country, every republic has its own rights. They are .independent. But let us come back to the ques tion of what you say about the U.S.S.R. Do you say anything good in your newspapers? Roosevelt: I think there has been improvement, and there is not quite the villification that I find in your newspapers here. But I would like to add that I don't find antagonism towards us among the people. They have been kind and welcoming. Roosevelt: Are you anxious, sir, for more mutual economic interchange? Khrushchev: Yes, we are. Not because we need it but because economic intercourse is the best way to improve relations. You don't want to have trade with our country because you don't want to give us military secrets. But it doesn't matter, because we have atomic weapons. We are not going to buy arms from you, but we shall be pleased to trade with you. (Here Dr. Gurewitsch broke in and said: What else is there to do to improve' our relations?) Roosevelt: That is what I am most anxious to find out. Khrushchev: Tell the truth to the people of the U.S.A. Tell the truth about the Soviet govern ment and about our country. You hate Communists. Roosevelt: I don't hate Com munists as people. I happen to believe that through a free de mocracy you actually develop a more independent and stronger people and give them the op portunity to achieve more. That is a personal belief and I can ; quite understand the socialist belief, but that does not mean ! I want to see their belief spread by methods ( of propaganda that are not always open and above board by hidden methods. I am quite willing that both of us should do our best to prove that our way is the best for the future. But I feel we will .have to find a method for going for ward toward more amicable re lations or we will end in a war that none of us want. (Dr. Gurewitsch, breaking in: Sir, you .just said: "We love peace but we are convinced that Communism will spread over the world.'" How is that to be done peacefully? You either acknow ledge that an opposite idea has j a chance or you simply wipe i out the opportunity for coexist ence. You must accept that two things ' can go on even though they may not lead to a complete meeting of minds at any point.) Khrushchev: Many people be lieve that Communism is better than the system that exists at present. (Dr. Gurewitsch again: Isn't there a contradiction in what you are saying? We talked before about . coexistence and in the same breath you say that you are convinced that Communism will spread throughout the world. Aren't you doing every thing possible to speed up that process?) Khrushchev: Oh, no, there is no contradiction. What I said about the spread of Communism" is like telling about the law of nature. I am firmly convinced this is the natural course of his tory and has nothing to do with our living peacefully together and stopping the threat of des troying each other. Roosevelt: We both know then that the bombs are dangerous and can annihilate the world. Khrushchev: We are in favor of full disarmament. We don't need any arms if you accept our existence and stop interfering wherever you can. Roosevelt: But we, too, are for disarmament, but there has to be some international inspection. Khrushchev: We are for in ternational inspection, but first there has to be confidence and then inspection. Mr. Dulles wants inspection without confi dence. Roosevelt: I think the confi dence and the inspection have to come together. We have to start and gradually increase our plans. Khrushchev: Quite right. Only gradually it can be done. Roosevelt: Would you agree to limited inspection if we could make a beginning? Khrushchev: But I quite agree. That is what we proposed. We propose inspection in ports, on highways, on roads, at airports, and it is to be an inter-nation in spection. But in answer to our proposal, Mr. Dulles makes a statement which sounds as though he was making propo ganda for 'the atom bomb, try ing to make it palatable. He talks of a clean bomb as if there were such a thing as a clean bomb. War is a dirty thing. But you refused our suggest ion. You insist on this flying business and looking at our fac tories. You know those rockets made the situation more fright ful. Now we can destroy coun tries in a few minutes. How many does it take to destroy West Germany? How many for France? How many for England? Just a few. We have now H bombs and rockets. We do not even have to send any bombers. A OWSIOH Of PACTfIC FWMVCC PACIFIC INDUSTRIAL 16 S. Central Phone SP 3-5308 Roosevelt: And soon small countries will have the atomic bombs. Khrushchev: Why not? Re search goes on. They learn about it. Let's get together so there shall be no war. We are ready to sign such an agreement now. Roosevelt: Your people cer tainly want peace, and I can assure you that our people want peace, too. Khrushchev: Do you think we, the government, want war? Roosevelt: Not the people, but governments, make war. And then they persuade the people that it is in a good cause, the cause of their own defense. Those arguments can be made by both your government and by ours. Khrushchev: That's right. Can we say we had a friendly con versation? Roosevelt: You can say , We had a friendly conversation, but we differ. Khrushchev: Now, we didn't shoot at each other. what T can give you of actual quotations. There was, however, a very interesting discussion on a sub ject that is of great general in terest because it touches on the Near East situation. So I will de vote my next column to this part of our talk, though I will not be quoting Mr. Khrushchev's exact words. (Copyright, 1957, by United Fea tures Syndicate, Inc. Use Mail Tribune Want Adi The Low Cost Way to Sell This was really the end of Attention! Peoples Market NOW OPEN TILL 11 P.M. Daily 304 N. Main, Ashland Across from Briscoe School Ben Day .and Richard W. Courtright ANNOUNCE The OPENING of LAW OFFICES at 206 Fluhrer Bldg. Phone SP 2-5217 New! A cleaner-burning gasoline guaranteed to give your car DtfflDfL than any other premium in the West! HIGHER OCTANE! Many modern gasolines are not clean burning. They leave deposits, cause fouled carburetors and spark plugs, sticky rings, burnt valves. Your engine loses its quick responsiveness too soon. 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