Morning Oregonian., November 21, 1908, Page 5, Image 5

the sroRxrvG oregoxian. Saturday, yovEMBEs 21, 1903.
IMMENSE PROFITS
OF STANDARD OIL
Amounted to $80,000,000 in
Year 1907 and Surplus
Is $300,000,000.
JOHN D. HAS NO EASY TIME
When Kellogg's Questions Grow Em
barrasslng. He Pleads loss of
Memory Tells of Contracts
to Squeeze Independents.
(rnmlnue.1 From Ftrrt Pa.f
value of cash and property turned in. ex
clusive of money, earned and turned
baek into this property."
Mr. Rockefeller ald he did not nulte
comprehend the. Increase of 13.non.HiO.
and Mr. KeMoKK discontinued this line of
inquiry, tie. next asked:
Standard's Immense Profits.
"The reoord shows that up to 190 the
ret earnings of the company were $:.M.
8;;.9f4. What was the dividend In 1007?"
"I should say about er cent."
"That was about jsa.'inn.nnor'
"That would be a million In favor of
the poor old Standard." said Mr. Rocke
feller. He added that the net earnings
for 1917 were approximately JSO.OtO.O'irt.
Mr. KellnK attain asked if he consid
ered the business risky on such a show
inr. and Mr. Rockefeller aaln retorted
that the profits did not determine the
risk. It was evidence that the business
was prosperous. He assented to Mr. Kel-
-Kir's figures showing that the company
earned t.O0.0 from ISM to 19.
Adding the earnings of 1907. would
irtve the total earnings of J.".7il.000.ixK).
Then where does the hazard of the
business come In 7" asked Mr. KelloRK.
"In the first place, since the first re
finery was built more than 6") years ago
we have been prepared at any moment,
lay or night, to hear the fire alarm. We
are dealing with a very explosive product.
Klres are constantly occurring "
"But your profits were above your fire
losses, which have been charged to profit
and loss account."
"Yes. sir."
Mr. Rockefeller said another rtek was
the peculiar construction of refining ma
chinery which could be used for no other
purpose. One could never tell when ho
would awake and find the crude oil sup
ply exhausted.
Rebate Deal With ICailraads.
Mr. Kellogg then aked Mr. Rockefel
ler about the Standard Oil agreement with
the I'ennsylvania Railroad in IS. i. In
which the Pennsylvania agreed to pay
back per cent of the freight rates
which the Standard paid. The witness
said this agreement followed the rate war
between the Northern and Southern lines
and that there was an agreement where
by he was to equalize the amount of
freight distributed between the different
railroa de
Mr. Kcnogg read the agreement which
showed that it provided that the Stand
ard Oil fompany wns to ship I.OOO.ono bar
rets of oil a year. When the tJovernment
counsel asked if other railroads besides
made a 1'ke agreement for a 10 per cent
rebate. Mr. Rockefeller referred him to
tlie men who conducted the negotiations.
Replying to Mr. Kellogg's question wheth
er the Standard oil Company was the
only one to get the rebate, the witness
said that the greater volume of business
given by the Standard was In part re
sponsible for the rebate, and that In
those days It was the custom for large
shippers to receive consideration.
"We sought to secure what all ship
pers then and now seek." said Mr. Rock
efeller. He did not recall what was
O'Day's connection with this matter, but
said Mr. O'Pay was general manager of
the Columbia Conduit Company, which
was purchased by the Standard In 1S77.
Kebate on Independent Shipments.
Mr. Kellogg then read letters of Mr.
O'Day to Mr. t'assatt. of the Pennsyl
vania Railroad. In which it was stated
that the American Transfer Company
received a rebate of -0 cents a barrel
from the Xtke Shore road, and it was
requested that the Pennsylvania give the
same rebate. It was shown in the let
ters that the Pennsylvania did so.
"Don't you know that Mr. O'Pay and
Mr. Cassatt both testified that the Amer
ican Transfer Company the Standard
Oil Company was not only paid a rebate
of 20 cents a barrel on Its own shipments,
but a rebate on the shipment of oil by
Independent refineries?" asked Mr. Kol
loag. ' Vy attention has been called to such
testimony." said Mr. Rockefeller.
M-. R v-kcf. Her said that he was presi
dent cf ;h Standard OH Company and
had aenerr.l direction of it at that time.
-Ttl you know of the contract
whereby the Standard was to obtain
I'l cents a barrel in rebate on outside
shipments 7"
"I mar have known of It generally
st the time. I had nothing to do with
the contract."
The wicness said he could not ro
ca'l wheth.r Mr. Cassatt had testified
that these rebates were paid to the
American Transfer Company. His
mind, he said, was engaged in more
tmportant problems.
KnTh-s Artist His Talent.
During the rwinljy Intermission. Mr.
K-kcfe!ler took to task the newspaper
r-'port rs for printing his maxims on the
care of the stomach.
"Pon't you boys think you violated my
con ti.ler.ee 7" he asked with a qulxxicai
mile. "I meant what I said for your
epevlal benefit, but I suppose the advice
Is good for everybody, so I don't care
verv much."
Mr. K.-K-kofeller asked one of the artists
w to ha.l been sketching him to let him
see tlie picture.
"I wish 1 had your talent." said the
richest man In the world, gaxluff earnestly
at the portrait of himself.
"I wis'.i 1 had yours." quickly responded
the artist.
Mr. Ko. k. feMer laughed heartily and ex
tended hand, winch the artist shook,
tiie Stan.):.--.! Oil man saying:
"We oug'.'.c to pool Issues."
Va Imrped With Conspiracy.
Aff-r re. ess. Mr. Kellogg took up with
!r. Rockefeller tiie rates for transporta
tion of oil prior to the construction of the
trunk pipelines. Prior to lM. Mr. Rocke-f-Iier
said, all of the crude oil shipped
to the seaboard by the Standard Oil Com
pany was carried by railroads. Henry
V. FTag.er and John D. Archbold had
much to do with making the transporta
tion arrangements, but William Rocke
feller did not lake such an important
part in It. Mr. Rockefeller said he had
no doubt the state of Pennsylvania
brought suit in 1T9 to oust the United
ripe Une from that state on the ground
ti.at it was In conspiracy with the Penn
sylvania, Railroad to obtain preferential
rates and drawbacks. He did not recall
the names of the parties to an agreement
for the dismissal of the suit.
'Don t you recall that Mr. -assatt testi
fied that the Pennsylvania Railroad paid
rebates to the Standard Oil Company,
i TraasXar 4Co.mjan oad. the
L'nlted Pipe, Une Company?" asked Mr.
Kellogg.
"Mr. Cassatt may have testified to those
rebates. I don't know about It. as I had
nothing to do with the payment. This
was a number of years after I had re
tired from participation In freight ar
rangements." Mr. Rockefeller said he signed the
agreements by which the suit was dis
missed, but did not recall the details,
although he remembered there was some
trouble about freight rates.
Can't Itemember Rebate Suit.
Mr. Kellogs read the testimony of A.
J. Cassatt in a case brought by the
State of Pennsylvania against the Penn
sylvania Railroad. In which Mr. Cassatt
said that the Pennsylvala agreed to pay
the 10 per cent rebate to the Standard
because It might divert its trade to
other lines. Mr. Rockefeller said, he
did not recall Mr. Cassatfs testimony,
nor did he remember the construction
of an independent pipeline for those
refiners who were unable to obtain the
same rate from the Pennsylvania Rail
road as did the Standard.
"Po you mean to say that you don t
recall the suit against your company
for receiving rebates?"
"I may have had the knowledge at
the time."
Levied Toll on Independents.
Mr. Kellogg then called the witness'
attention to a terminal agreement by
which, he said, the Standard obtained
the use of the terminals of the Erie and
New York Central Railroads and which
he said provided that all the oil trans
ported by any person over the New.
York Central Railroad should be de
livered to the terminals provided by the
Standard at Hunter's Point. Mr. Rel
inks: asked If warehouse charges were
made against the independent oil refin
ers at these terminals.
Mr. Rockefeller said they were made.
He did not recall whether the other
railroads paid the New York Central a
certain percentage for warehousing the
ol! hey carried.
Replying to other questions. Mr.
Rockefeller snld he could not recall
whether the Standard Oil Company con
troi'ed the National Storage Company,
which was the terminal of the Penn
sylvania Itaiiroad Company at Commu
nipaw. or whether he used these oil ter
minals from 1K7S to ISM. He could not
state how long the Standard controlled
the terminals of the Krie and New York
Central roads. He said lie was in the
Kast, and that was a detail.
Fight on South Improvement.
Mr. Rockefeller said that the Standard
had little to say about the South Im
provement Company, but participated in
the meeting when It was organized. He
did not think it was organized before he
had purchased any refineries in Cleve
land, and he did not think that all of the
stock in that company was acquired by
men who were later associated with him.
Mr. Kellogg then read the list of stock
holders of the South Improvement Com
pany and asked Mr. Rockefeller about the
agitation which followed the organization
of this company.
"I can hardly explain the reason for
the excitement of those gentlemen." re
plied Mr. Rockefeller.
"Was it not the enormous rebates that
the railroads were to pay?"
"It was probably due to mlsapprehenr
slon on the part of the independent ship
pers." Mr. Rockefeller's attention was called
to the agreement with the South Im
provement Company and the agreements
provided therein for rebates on oil.
W hat t'aueA Excitement.
Is It not a fact that all other parties, accord
ing to thts agreement, were to be charged the
full sross rale?
, lrohahjr po.
Was It not that feature that created the
excitement among the independents?
It might have been one of the causes, but
I could hanlly recollect, after 40 years, all
the causes.
Veu mv the Standard did not agree with
thw pmiwsitlons of the Fotith Improvement
Ompjri. but is It not a fact that the Stand
ard signed a manifesto supporting the South
Improvement Conipany?
It may have been. I rather think it must
have been the Standard (Ml Company of
Pittsburg. I have no recollection of the Stand
ard oil Company of Cleveland signing It.
Were you a stockholder of the South Im
provement Company?
I never received the certificate, as I can
recollect.
lo oil remember that In March, 12. there
was a Standard oil Company of Pittsburg?
Doors Open to All.
I think so. I think that It wan a living
concern.
Would It be natural that a company like
yonrs would Join In the manifesto?
vWell. It Is likely that Mr. Warden, who
hd many interests in the region, would have
leeued the circular.
hat understanding did you have of the
agreement ?
I should say that the agreement would
have been to help the business of the prod-jeer,
refiner and transporter.
That b all who ram In would profit, but
how about those who did not come in?
The doors mere open.
How did you know the doors wer open?
That wu the theory of the gentlemen who
orKantied. All the refiners were expected to
come Into it.
What communication was made to the In
dependents that they could come Into thle
agreement?
I could not say.
Was not the contract kept secret for some
tin:
It msv have been.
Mr. Rockefeller said the plan was
quickly ahandoned. He said he did not
know whether the Independent refiners In
Cleveland were asked to come in.
Pid you Inform the Independents whom you
boucht' out that they mlffht have the benefit
of this agreement?
I don't recall. As a matter of -fart, I did
not believe In this thing.
How did the Independent refiners whom you
bought out know that they might have had
the benefit of this agreement?
I could not say.
About the time of the South Improvement
Company wero frelcht rates increased?
That I rould not say.
drawback on Freight Rates.
You spoke yesterday of a pool arrangement
among eeeral rallroa-is for dividing uo traf
fic an.1 freight rates In 1S74. Mr. Mllhurn
read to iwi a clause providing fur a .Iraw-ba.-k
to the Standard Oil Company of ihe full
rate they paid for all crude oil writ to Cleve
land f.r eli-ort reflnlnx purposes. S'o the ru:es
from Cleveland to seaboar-t were the same as
from oil pulnts In I'ennsylvania to the spa
te -r.l?
Yes.
Ar-1 the r.-a-'e carrvlnr crude ell to sea
beanl were required to par a drawback of
cents a barrel to the shipper. If the rates
on pipeaee to the shipping poinus on the road
be mainlalne-1?
Ye.
w hat pipe lines maintained the agreed rates
of pipease.
I supi-se those pipe lines that were In
cluded in the agreement.
Mr. Kellogg then sought td show that
all the pipe line companies parties to the
agreement were subsidiary companies of
the Standard. Mr. Rockefeller, after go
ing over the list, said:
We had an Interest In some, but not In
all.
Secretly. Owned Pratt Co.
Yon testified yesterday to the stockholders
of the Stan-lard Oil Company from 1S72 to
179. obtainirs Interests In slocks of other re
fining companies?
I did.
I call your attention to Charles Pratt ft Co.
You said this was a-o.ulred In 1ST4T
I believe so.
The company was Charles Pratt and H. H.
H-gens and It mas doing a refining and ex
porting business?
Yea
Did they sell their proirtle or take stock
in the Standard?
We bought the entire concern. It was
K-urht with the funrts of the shareholders of
the srannard Oil Company or the capital shares
o? the Standard. In this I think me used the
stock of the Standard.
Do you mean that Mr. Pratt and Mr. Rog
ers te-lreJ from biJeiness?
Oh. no. They save up the Pratt stock and
later became t-artners of the Standard.
Old Mr. Pratt and Mr. Rogers stay In
possession of the business and for over
five years was It supposed to the world that
ttiev still m ned it 7
Presumably they did.
Old not Mr Pratt and Mr. Rogers receive
salaries for their m ork 7
I believe they did
Is It not so that the Pratt stock went to
the Standard and the Standard slock went
to the Pratt Company?
No. the standard got the Pratt stock and
the om-ners of the Pratt Company received
the Standard Slock. .
Adjournment was then taken until
Monday.
-
William Mcilurray. general passen
ger agent for tho Harriman lines In
this territory, left last night for San
Francisco oa ft buslnewwi vifi.
SUPERS REPORT
IS FULLYir4D0RSED
Federation Backs Its Presi
' dent and He Retains
Complete Control.
NO OPPOSITION TO KEEFE
Gompers Attacks Socialists Declar
ing Party Is Kndeavoring to Dis
rupt Trades Vnion Movement.
Takes Fling at Debs.
DENVER. Colo.. Nov. 10. At no time
since the opening of the convention of
the American Federation of Labor has
there been any doubt that President
Gompers was In complete control, but It
was thought possible that a part of his
report might be materially amended or
his political course condemned. The re
port was before the convention- for 4
day and a half, and although for a while
there was a vigorous discussion of some
of its contents. It was adopted this aft
ernoon and Mr. Gompers thereby fully
Indorsed.
Elect Old Officers.
Tomorrow morning at 10 o'clock the
election of officers will be the special
order of business. All the old officers
probably will be elected, with tho ex
ception of Vice-President Daniel E.
Keefe. and even he may again be voted
into office.
It is reported that the nutlets have
decided to support Mr. Keefe for re
election, and they have the largest vote
of any union in the convention. It is
also reported that Mr. Gompers will not
oppose Mr. Keefe. but ihis cannot be
confirmed, as the president refuses to be
interviewed on the subject.
On the report of the committee on the
president's report there was a section
commending tho course of tho American
Federatlonist. the official organ. Objec
tion to this was made by the leading
Socialists present. They wanted the re
port amended so that a committee could
be appointed to investigate the sources
of income of the Socialist party in the
recent campaign. This Information was
desired because of an attack upon Eugene
V. Debs that appeared in the Federa
tlonist. An amendment to this was offered to
ask the Socialists if they wcrs respon
sible for attacks matlo r.n the Federa
tion officials in the Socialist pi ess.
Denies Gompers Charges.
This amendment was adopted and pre
cipitated a debate in which a number
of delegates took part, including Presi
dent Gompers. J. M. Barnes closed the
discussion, and in the course of his re
marks denied several of tho charges
made by President Gompers. Mr. Gom
pers desired to speak a second time, but
Delegate Barnes objected. Hy this ob
jection the Socialists lost all they had
gained by their eloquence, nnj the con
vention promptly voted down their
amendment and adopted the debated sec
tion. The remainder of the committee's re
port was adopted without discussion.
At this point Delegate T. L. I.ew!s, of
the miners. Interrupted the proceedings,
and in an eloquent speech presented on
behalf of the convention to President
Gompers a handsome silver loving cup,
and to Mrs. Gompers a diamond ring.
Mr. Gompers was overcome by the good
will of tho delegates, coming as it did
at the end of a hard fight, and could
scarcely control his feelings as ho
thanked the convention.
A resolution commending the efforts of
President Roosevelt In behulf of the con
servation of the natural resources was
unanimously adopted. ' The resolution
that the Federation erect a building suit
able for lis uses at Washington, D. C,
also was adopted.
Woman Delegate Admitted.
Before the president's report was taken
tip today, Mrs. Harriet G. R. Wright,
president of the Colorado Equal Suffrage
Association, was elected fraternal dele
gate representing the National American
Womans Eqiml Suffrage Association.
Consideration of the committee's report
on the president's report was then re
sumed. The recommendation of the com
mittee on the subject "Legislation and
Political Action," which caused a long
debate yesterday, carrying with it the
recommendation that any member of the
executive council who does not agree with
any action of the executive council
should resign, was adopted without de
bate. The only remarks made were by
John Mitchell, of the Miners' Union, who
wanted it understood that the recom
mendation of the committee did not re
fer to religious opinions.
When the point in the committee re
port Indorsing the American Federatlon
ist. the official organ, was reached. J. M.
Barnes, of the Cigamiakers. protested
auirst an editorial which had appeared
during the political campaign, asking:
Who Financed Kcd Special?
"Who Is financing the. Red Special V
The "Red Special" was the train in
which the Socialist Presidential candi
date, Kugene V. Debs, made his cam
paign. The editorial also charged that
tho forces opposed to labor were financ
ing the "Red Special."
Mr. Barnes offered a resolution calling
upon the convention to appoint a commit
tee to go over the books of the Socialist
party and ascertain where the funds were
obtained. The resolution was signed by
all the Socialist members who are dele
gates to this convention, and nearly ail
the-Socialist delegates spoke In its favor.
t! J. Duffy, of the pottery workers,
moved that before the amendment to the
report be considered the Socialists present
be asked if they indorsed editorials ap
pearing In Socialist organs attacking the
federation and its officers.
Gompers Attacks Socialists.
Mr. Gombers defended the editorial In
question. He asked why the only para
graph in the editorial In which he had
expressed an opinion is taken up and
every charge in the editorial is over
looked, for. he declared, he did make a
number of charges. Mr. Gompers charged
that the Socialists were trying to dtsrupt
the trades union movement. He said that
there never had appeared a more severe
arraignment of tlie officers of the Federa
tion in the hostile press than had ap
peared in the Cleveland Citizen, edited by
Max Hayes, a representative of the Typo
graphical Cnlon in the convention.
Mr. Gompers said he had no lllwlll
against any man personally and that he
fought solely for the trades union move-
lament, Ua bad so UlwUl .towards evenjment League, at Its -xegulax meeUnjJUmuehdlaoiilacs.
Eugene V. Debs or Daniel de Leon, of the
Industrial workers oi me nonu, Al
though both were trying to destroy the
trade union movement. In regard to the
charges In the editorial, he said they
must be true or the Socialist delegates
would have repudiated them. These
charges dealt with the political history of
llr. Debs.
Socialists Called to Aflswer.
The convention got into a parliamentary
tangle over whether Mr. Barnes should
have the floor to reply to Mr. Gompers
after the previous question had been
ordered and it took more than half an
hour to straighten the matter out.
Mr. Duffy's motion was finally agreed
to.
C. B. Grant, of the metalpollshers. was
called upon as the first of the 16 Social
ists in the convention to speak to the
subject. He said he was not responsible
for the. editorials, but that he believed
there had been cases where labor leaders
had sold out, although he made no
charges against tbe Federation officers.
The convention had begun to become
tangled again with motions to lay the
whole matter on the table and personal
appeals, when the noon recess was taken.
SAYS Wlsffli HOUSE
DEFEASE OF LAMPHERE THINKS
MRS. Gl'XXESS ALIVE.
Theory Is That, Knowing Discovery
of Helgelein Murder Xear, Poi
soned and Burned Victims.
LA PORTE, Ind., Nov. 20. Excellent
progress was made by the defense today
In placing testimony before the jury in
the trial of Ray Lamphere. It Is ex
pected that Dr. Walter Hays, of Chicago,
will be here tomorrow to testify that he
found poison in the stomachs of Andrew
Helgelein and three of the four bodies
taken from the ruins of the fire.
Lamphere In Corner.
The state rested today after the de
fense had finished the cross-examination
of Deputy Sheriff Anstiss. The deputy
testified to admissions alleged to have
been made by Lamphere following his
arrest.
The state lays great stress on two
points in the testimony of Anstiss. First,
his statement that Lamphere had ad
mitted he would not deny having seen
Mrs. Gunness kill Helgelein. and second.
Anstiss' statement that Lamphere would
not take the stand. Lamphere's lawyers
now find that unless their client takes
the stand, the admission said to have
been made by him to Anstiss cannot be
controverted.
Says Mrs. Gunness Burned House.
Mr. Wrorden made his opening state
ment for the defense. He said he would
prove that it was not Mrs. Gunness'
body which was found in the ruins of
the house: that Mrs. Gunness had been
seen in July by a neighbor and by two
girls; that the dental work identified as
having been placed by Dr. Norton in the
mouth of Mrs. Gunness could not have
gone through the fire, and that the four
persons whose bodies were found in the
ruins of the fire died of poisoning. Mr.
Worden said:
Feared Detection of Murders.
Our evidence will show that Mrs Gunness
is still alive. She had a motive in setting
fire to the house and our evidence will show
that Mrs. Gunness knew that certain people
suspected er of having committed many
crimes. She was asked questions at a trial
at Stillwell when she had Lamphere ar
rested for trespass. She knew that Inquiry
would be made regarding these things. I
believe the evidence will show that on April
27 there was a certain crlels in her life
she was expecting Helgelein here to lnves
tifrate his brother's disappearance; that she
thought Ray lamphere knem- more of these
things than she would have him know and
rVat all these things culminated at this time.
Our evidence m-111 show that she had reason
to commit the crime she did on April 28.
The evidence will show that she did commit
the crime.
TWENTY PEOPLE ENGULFED
(Continued From First Page.)
hole under tons of wreckage. Two other
children were on the opposite side of the
street when the sidewalk caved in and
they lost their lives.
Samuel Trout, foreman of the gang of
laborers, was near the woman and" three
children who lost their lives. He rushed
forward in an endeavor to save them,
but he, too, was drawn into the death
hole. His body was the first recovered.
It had been roasted almost to a cinder.
Only four of the men working In the
excavation escaped, and their escape was
remarkable. They were Arthur Strand.
Frank Schwold. John C. Crane and an
Tmiian laborer known as "John." These
men were digging near the opening of
a four-foot sewer and the force or tne
explosion blew them to the entrance of
it Strand was hurled farthest in and
pulled the other three men after him.
Remarkable Escape.
Water from the broken main began to
pour Into the sewer and the four men, in
danger of being drowned, started to run
toward the river, where there was an out
let from the sewer.
By the time they reached the river the
water was up to their waists.
The known dead are:
SMUFTL. TROUT, foreman.
FREDERICK SCHEFFMEYER, Inspec
tor of sewers.
CHARLES FARRELL. foreman of con
crete work.
GL'STAVB ANDERSON, foreman of
carpenters.
More than 39 persons are missing.
The police arrested seven men who were
attached to the city departments In
charge of the work.
The excavation was said to have been
nearly 60 feet deep and as the laborers re
moved the earth the walls had been
shored up by large timbers. With Charles
Scheffmeyer. a city inspector of sewers,
overseeing the work, the men were work
ing at the bottom of the trenoh when an
accumulation of gas from a main which
bad bean accidentally broken during the
course of the work exploded with a tre
mendous force.
Big Buildings Shaken.
The supporting timbers were ripped
away and the high dirt walls toppled over
on Scheffmeyer and his men. A large
water main also was broken by the force
of the explosion and a perfect torrent of
water began to spurt up through the mass
of wreckage. Almost side by side with
these geysers reared the flames from the
gas escaping from the broken main.
Firemen and workmen from the city
water department and from the gas com
pany worked desperately together in an
effort to check the flow of gas and water
and to relieve the men who had been im
prisoned. There seemed little hope, how
ever, that any of those who had been at
work at the bottom of the trench could
have escaped death. Their bodies are be
lieved to be buried under tons of earth.
The explosion was followed by
scenes of Intense excitement. Every
building for blocks around had been
severely shaken. A large Roman Cath
olic Church and a parochial school re
ceived nearly the full force of the
shock. In the immense crowd which
flocked to the scene were mothers who
feared that their little ones In the
school building were in danger.
Toledo After Good Roads.
TOLEDO, Or.. Nov. 20. (Special.)
The citizens of Lincoln County are be
coming enthusiastic over the good
roads movement. The Toledo Develop-
"THE STUB"
MEANS
COMFORT
mm
flood
"THE STUB'
MEANS
COMFORT
2.7 O
next Tuesday evening, will take up and
agitate the good roads -question. It is
expected that many people will attend
this meeting, and that much work
along th line of good roads will be
started.
ABOLISH LUMBER TARIFF
(Continued From First Page.)
latter believing in a tariff for revenue
only.
If the ways and means committee ad
heres to its attitude, as disclosed to
day, tho lumber interests will have to
look to tho Senate for protection. The
Northwestern lumbermen who are here
are heartily discouraged by today's de
velopments. ALL VXlVEKSAIi GUAR GAME
Champ Clark Scores Tariff When
Lumber Kate Is Discussed.
WASHINGTON, Nov. 2D. "A universal
grab game" was the appellation given the
tariff by Representative Champ Clark, of
Missouri, today at the hearing before the
ways and means committee on .the tariff
schedule for wood and wood manufac
tures. The administration's policy for the
preservation of the forests figured largely
in the argument.
Several lumbermen said they wanted a
protective tariff on lumber because other
articles were protected by the law. This
called forth the term "grab" from Mr.
Clark. Representative Boutell, of Illinois,
asserted in defense of the protective tariff
that the Government must secure $300,000,
0(i0 in revenue, and that,' as a result, in
dustries must be protected.
How to Save Forests.
That free trade In lumber would tend to
prevent the devastation of the American
timbcrlands was the opinion expressed by
Mr. Clark, who said that it did not mat
ter if Canada devastated her forests. Mr.
Boutell argued that the American forests
would have to supply the lumber for both
countries, if the Canadian forests should
be depleted, and suggested that some
broader scheme than the tariff should be
adopted for reforesting the United States
and Canada.
A number of lumbermen from the
Northwest want the tariff on timber
taken off. T'he National Association of
Furniture Manufacturers has declared
that there should be immediate reduction
on certain tariff rates, which they assert
have enabled a few beneficiaries to com
bine and destroy competition. This asso
ciation, which represents 800 members,
haviruj an output of M0,000,000 worth of
furniture, also has gone on record in fa
vor of a maximum and minimum tariff
law.
Change Boxwood Schedules.
The paragraph of the wood schedule
providing for a 60 per cent reduction
on orange and lemon boxes made of
American shooks will be changed so
that the Secretary of the Treasury will
prescribe the regulations under which
proof of the identity of such shooks
shall be made.
Changes will be made in the tariff
covering manufactures of wood, in
cluding furniture, in order to overcome
the effect of certain decisions regard
ing the meaning Intended by the pres
ent tariff: law. Manufacturers of bark
will be specified to take the same rate
of duty as wood manufactures.
"We have already crossed the verge
TO RELIEVE
DISTRESS
Pnt An End to Stomach Trouble So
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"THE STUB"
What Kind of Feet Have
feet are no sure indication of genius
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One of the most appropriate
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FOR MEN WOMEN
mm
WASHINGTON STREET.
of a timber famine so severe that its
blight will be felt in every hamlet in
tho land." said Theodore M. Knappen,
a real estate dealer of Minneapolis, at
today's hearing. "In five years every
sawmill 'n Minneapolis will be aban
doned; yet this industry in its prime
employed 6000 to 10.000 men."
He spoke for a repeal of the duty on
timber, saying that American labor
had nothing to fear from free trade,
as Canadian labor was as high as labor
in this country. Mr. Knappen said he
represented the National Forest Con
servation League, but when asked by
Representative Fordney of whom the
league consisted, he said:
"Mostly of myself."
"Aro the farmers of the Northwest
In favor of free trade in lumber?"
asked Mr. Crumpacker of A. A. Rogers,
of Minneapolis, who appeared in favor
of free entry of timber.
-yes," the witness replied.
"Do you mean Washington and Ore
gon?" asked Mr. Fordney.
"No. they are producing states, re
plied Mr. Rogers. "I mean the prairie
states."
Mr Rogers said he did not believe
there" was a monopoly in the lumber
business.
What Causes Dear Lumber.
"What is it that has caused the
enormous advance in the price of lum
ber?" asked Representative Champ
Clark, of Missouri.
"There are several reasons, replied
Mr. Rogers, "but the principal one is
to make more money."
F. P. Lynch, of St. Paul, M. J. Scan
Ian, of Minneapolis, and A. W. Gilbert,
of Duluth, Minn., also spoke in favor
of the repeal of the duty on lumber.
"If the tariff on lumber is removed."
asked Mr. Boutell, of Illinois, "will a
man be able to build a six-room cottage
any cheaper as far as the tariff is
concerned?"
Mr. Scanlan replied in the negative.
Mr. Payne wanted to know what the
effect of retaining the present tariff
would be.
"We could, I think, have abnormal
advances in the price of lumber," said
the witness.
. Pleads for Protection.
That he needed protection was as
serted by J. B. White, a lumber manu
facturer of Kansas City, Mo., in asking
that the present rate of duty on lumber
be retained, if not increased. He ar
gued that a protective tariff would tend
to conserve the forests of the country
on the theory that every stray log In
the forest would be used in manufac
ture. "How . about President Roosevelt. Gif
ford Plnchot and these other gentlemen
who are arguing for free trade in lum
ber in order to conserve the forests of
the country?" asked Mr. Clark.
"They have not heard me talk," was
the ready reply.
Edward Hines. a large lumber manu
facturer, of Chicago, argued for protec
tion on the ground that Canada has the
advantage of cheaper transportation fa
cilities and lower cost of labor.
J. A. Brown, of North Carolina, said
that on account of the higher cost of
labor, stumpage and supplies for the
lumber industry, 60 per cent of the lum
ber mills of North Carolina are shut
down, their operation proving unprofit
able. Stumpage Too High.
Mr. Clark maintained that the nigh
price of lumber was due to speculation
on the part of the lumber producers.
The witness argued that the price of
ST01CH
Ai CURE INDIGESTION
Some folks have tried so long to
find relief from Indigestion with the
common every-day cures advertised
that they have about made up their
minds that they have something else
wrong, or believe theirs Is a case of
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This is a serious mistake. Tour
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"THE STUB"
MEANS
COMFORT
You?
aa the brain
or high cut3.
shoes for the
mane m ucavj
well viscolized
keep out com,
"THE STUB"
MEANS
COMFORT
stumpage. one of the principal cost
items in procuring lumber, was too high.
J. A. Freeman, of St. Louis, D. B.
Skinner, of San Francisco, and C. W.
Nibley, of Oregon, added their voices
to the appeal for the continuation of the
protective tariff on lumber. Mr. Nibley
admitted that the protits in his busi
ness were 10 to 15 per cent under a pro
tective tariff.
The committee took a recess for din
ner at 7 o'clock, resuming tne hearing an
hour later, when several lumbermen and
witnesses interested in reeds and rattan
appeared in favor of a protective tariff.
(ErtaMlBlioa 1879)
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