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Toure: The ‘who’s Afraid of post-blackness?’ interview
B
orn in Boston on March 20, 1971, Touré is a cul-
tural critic for MSNBC, as well as the host of a
couple of shows on Fuse-TV: “Hip Hop Shop” and
“On the Record.” A contributing editor at Rolling Stone,
his articles appear regularly in publications ranging from
The New York Times to The Village Voice to The New
Yorker.
Touré is also the author of a collection of essays called
“Never Drank the Kool-Aid,” a collection of short stories
called “The Portable Promised Land,” and a novel titled
“Soul City.” He serves on the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame
Nominating Committee, and is a member of the adjunct
faculty of the City University of New York’s Graduate
School of Journalism.
A devoted father, Touré lives in Fort Greene, Brooklyn
with his wife, Rita, and their two children, Hendrix and
Fairuz. Here, he talks about his new book, “Who’s Afraid
of Post-Blackness?”
kam williams: Hi Touré, thanks for the interview.
Touré: Hey, man, what’s happening?
kw: Not much. Nice to make your acquaintance.
T: Yours, too.
kw: I really enjoyed reading Who’s Afraid of Post-
Blackness, and I have a lot of my own questions for you,
as well as a lot from my readers.
T: Whatever you want to talk about is totally cool.
kw: What inspired you to write the book? Let me
guess, the incident in college where somebody embar-
rassed you by saying, “Shut up, Touré! You ain’t black!”
T: Yeah, that was definitely an inciting incident. I had
already been thinking very actively about what it means
to be black since I was very young. But that got me think-
ing about it with a different intensity on an extremely
deep, personal level. So, that sort of got the ball rolling,
but the more specific influence was the success of Barack
Obama which was an indication to me that something had
changed in terms of race and what it meant to be black in
America. We are not post-racial, but some things have
changed. For instance, I think the younger generation has
a more progressive attitude, and that definitely played to
Barack’s favor.
kw: Harriet Pakula Teweles says: It’s one thing for
artists to feel that blackness can mean anything. But how
can so many in the period you describe as post-blackness
give up being boxed in by race if they have neither the
educational nor economic opportunities to leave the ghet-
to locality?
T: What I’m saying is that you have the ability to
embody blackness however you wish. I believe Harriet’s
right that you see greater opportunity for education and
advancement as you go up the class scale, but America is
the land of rapid class ascension within a generation,
within a decade, even within a year. So, I don’t think this
only applies to middle-class black people. If you go into
the ‘hood, you’ll encounter a huge variety in terms of
blackness.
kw: In the book, you talk about being from Boston,
and how your parents taught as a child you that some
areas of the city were dangerous for blacks. I learned that
the hard way when I was in law school there in the
Seventies, like the time I was refused service in a pizze-
ria because I was black.
T: That highlights the stupidity of racism. You were
simply saying: “I’m just trying to give you money for the
thing that you produce. I’m not looking to start a fight;
I’m trying to engage in the commerce that you do every
day.” And they’re response was, “We don’t want your
money, because you’re black.” Unbelievable!
kw: Troy Johnson asks: Do you see any value in
the government census trying to keep track of people by
race: black, white, etcetera? If so, how can we truly
become post-racial??
T: I don’t think the goal is to become post-racial. I don’t
want a world in which we’re not thinking about race. I
want a world where people are proud to be who they are,
and where everybody feels comfortable imposing the
beauty of their culture on America. The goal is that prej-
udice based around those differences ends. Post-racialism
is not the goal, because it’s not even possible.
kw: Rene Harris says: One time during a Twitter inter-
action with you, you freely used the actual n-word, but
only referred to a slur against Jews as the k-word. When
I questioned you about it, you never answered. Care to
clarify now?
Page 6 The Seattle Skanner
I can ask other celebrities?
T: Yeah, who is the person that led
you to become the person you are?
C ELEBrITY
I NTErvIEw
kw: Thanks. That’ll be known as the
Touré question. The Tasha Smith ques-
tion: Are you ever afraid?
T: I suppose, but not very often,
because I always feel like there’s some-
thing I can do to get out of any situa-
tion, sort of like MacGyver.
by Kam
Williams
T: I remember that interaction. It
transpired a long time ago before I
made a personal decision to not
use the n-word anymore. Twitter is
a very particular venue where it
can be very easy for someone to
misunderstand something that
you’ve written. So, you have to be
very careful when you are dealing
with really incendiary ideas. For
me to use the n-word as a black
person is not going to be as poten-
tially controversial as using the k-
word. It can be tricky, if someone
reads my tone wrong. But there’s a big difference
between using a word and talking about that word.
kw: Judyth Piazza asks: What is something your fans
may not know about you?
T: I don’t know how to answer that question.
kw: Judyth also asks: What key quality do you believe
all successful people share?
T: The ability to take a “no,” because in order to
become successful at anything, you’re going to experi-
ence a lot of setbacks and a lot of doors closing.
kw: Editor/Legist Patricia Turnier asks: What message
do you want the public to take away from your book?
T: Two things: First, I want the black people made to feel
like outsiders because they like opera or sushi or scuba
diving to know that they’re not weird and that they are
black. You can do black and be black in any way you
choose. And secondly, I want the self-appointed, volun-
teer identity cops to be frozen in their tracks, because
they’re not really doing the race a service. It’ time for
them to take off their badges and let people be black in
whatever way they see fit.
kw: Patricia also says: In 1903, W.E.B. Du Bois said
that “The problem of the 20th Century would be the prob-
lem of the color line, the relation of the darker to the
lighter races of men in Asia and Africa, in America and
the islands of the seas.” If Du Bois were alive today, do
you think that he would just cross out 20th and change it
to 21st and consider it as relevant today, or would he see
another issue as the prevailing question of this Century?
T: Well sure, it’s still a dominant issue in America.
However, now, class enters the equation and makes it a
three-dimensional game, instead of a two-dimensional
game. So, the issue is only getting trickier and more
nuanced as class boundaries change, and as expectations
and perceptions change. Plus, there’s a growing class of
mixed people who are going to bring a variety of addi-
tional new perceptions.
kw: Finally, Patricia asks: What advice do you have for
young people who are interested in entering the field of
journalism?
T: Oh God! Think about something else that might
make you happy. I’m serious. I don’t think the opportuni-
ties are there to make a comfortable living in journalism
anymore.
kw: Professor/film director/author Hisani Dubose
asks: How did you first become a Pop Culture consultant
for CNN, and how did you go from there to being a reg-
ular contributor?
T: I started off at Rolling Stone. From there, I was given
an opportunity to appear on CNN with Paula Zahn when
she was hosting American Morning. That went well, and
they asked me back more and more, and eventually had
me do a panel three times a week called 90-Second Pop.
After that I became a correspondent.
kw: The Columbus Short question:
Are you happy?
T: Yeah, absolutely! I’ve got two
great kids and a wonderful wife. And I
just published the best book that I’ve
ever written. So, I’m very happy right
now.
kw: The Teri Emerson question:
When was the last time you had a good
laugh?
T: All the damn time! One of my kids
said something earlier today that was
incredibly funny.
kw: What is your guiltiest pleasure?
T: Bacon. It’s not just for breakfast anymore. I know it’s
wrong health-wise. But even though it’s wrong, I don’t want to
be right. At the butcher store, they’ll sometimes talk me into a
pork fillet which is like eating a steak of bacon. That couldn’t
be good for you.
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