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Continued from Page 1
tern of higher education for more than four years,
is the second of a two-part interview.
In Thursday's article. Bartlett said among other
things that in the past few weeks, legislators have
become more aware of the need for replacement
revenue, and the public's distinction between sec
ondary education and higher education is no longer
warranted because more people need further edu
cation to he able to support a family.
Today. Bartlett answers questions about what
to expect in the future from higher education and
the various options available to maintain a* many
existing programs, schools and positions as possi
ble in this time of instability.
Oregon Daily Emerald: Where do you see high
er education in the near future, if no replacement
revenue is found7
Bartlett: This session isn't going to lie a crisis dif
ference What is going to tie a crisis is 1095-97, and
the question is whether or not what's happening at
this legislature or the next biennium is having a
positive or negative impact in preparation for '95
97
(The 1995-97 biennium), if nothing else happens
between now and then, really changes the nature
of our state higher education system.
(The 1993-95 biennium) for most students will
not feel that different — paying a little more and
some inc onvenience. Into '95-97, if nothing hap
pens, there will be a lot fewer plac.es and there will
be some significant c hanges in organization and
structure
We can make the next biennium significantly bet
ter or worse by what happens in the Legislature
But the different* between (letter and worse will
be recognizable, although it won't be a different
world for us. '95-97 will be a different world It's
sad because it's not in the public: interest
ODE: What has to happen right now7 Are Ore
gonians ready for tax reform?
Bartlett: The answer to that about one or two
months ago would have been no. Now. c learly some
thing is happening since a lot of loc al communities
are realizing that five phases in. and the next phase
begins to bite.
Oregonians have always prided themselves on
local control and lcx.al responsibility. Well, now
we don't have that The problem with Measure 5
was that |M»opie wanted tux relief and what they got
was government c hange, systematic change and the
whole argument about the role of government.
There's a problem because you could have the
most perfect tax system but you'd still be arguing
about the role of government. Alternately, you could
have the most perfec t government system and still
have a crazy tax structure.
These two things — tux struc ture and public ser
vices — have come together, and together they're
extremely difficult to deal with.
Eighty perc ent of the funding for public schools
will go through the state Legislature if Measure 5
< ontinues That changes the whole nature of pub
lic. school funding and eventually it will change the
nature of public school government.
With all that money going through the Legisla
ture, the Legislature is definitely going to have a
huge impact on governments.
Now. we are going to spend a lot of time figuring
out how to deal with public services, political and
policy making structure and our tax structure — so
there is plenty to do for all of us for a long time.
ODE: Do you see any OSSHE institutions dosing
in the future, if no replacement revenue is found7
Bartlett: No. because you can’t do it in any prac
tical way There's never hewn a public: institution
that has changed to private in the United Stales.
In some instances, the share of the funds provided
by the students has gone up and those are the cas
es that some legislators have asked about and have
been looking into.
The problem with privatizing is that you can’t
make the change fast enough to deal with our pre
sent problems. It might help you eight to 10 years
from now. but that's so long from here. The ques
tion is how do we get through the next five years?
Today, privatization is just a euphemism for
putting more of the cost onto the students and less
on the public.
ODE: You've been known to support higher
Thomas Bartlatt
tuition naiancea
by increased finan
cial aid.
Bartlett: When !
talk about higher
tuition, my role is
not advocate. The
point is if we're
going into a stricter
rationing system in
higher education,
then you have to
ask yourself what
are the alterna
tives?
People often for
get that low tuition
means low access
because there aren't enough funds to go around lor
everyone to get a higher education. This is because
the state funding is set.
At what level of tuition, then, can the maximum
number of students attend? That calculation is a
combination of what are the resources that you have
from students and state together.
At what point do you drive the students out with
the higher cost faster than you could replace it with
the additional money? Where those two lines cross
is your maximum access — and that's not free
tuition
ODE: With higher tuition balanced by addition
al financial aid, are you concerned that a dumbbell
effect will result, meaning wealthy and poor stu
dents making up the majority of the student body?
Won't middle class students be priced out of an
education?
Bartlett: Yes But toll me which option is less bad
because it's not hard to think what's wrong with
the various courses. The question is what choices
have we really got and how do we moke the choic
es that make the least damage.
What's wrong with this is that the returns of high
er education to society are quite great — a sound
investment We have to worry, in Oregon, about a
downward spiral if we don't invest in higher edu
cation.
It would be so easy for this state to become a
colony. The folks that would come in from other
states would he in the high-value positions and the
folks that are here would be in the less-educated,
lower levels of activity. That's what we used to
define as a colony.
If Oregon doesn't educate it's own folks, we pro
vide a very attractive place for folks to come because
it's a nice place So we tan make the argument why
bother to educate our people — why not just import
them?
There's a certain logic to that, if you don't care
about the people who are here. Those of us who live
here should think about this hard when we decide
that we re not going to support education.
ODE: Finally, how optimistic are you about the
future of higher education in the state?
Bartlett: I am considerably more hopeful than I
was four weeks ago. The trends are improving. The
question is. are they improving fust enough And
that we won't know for a while but at least we have
reason to renew our energies and our hopes.
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